Interview: Nur-D "HVN"
Review by: Andy Ellis, Writer @andysmileyjay
Edited by: Andrew Perrizo, Owner/Editor @PlaylistTC
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It’s almost impossible to think of local indie Hip-Hop and not think of Nur-D. The Rosemount, Minnesota native has quickly made a name for himself, with his references to nerd culture, his energetic live shows, and, more recently, his activism. If you don’t know Nur-D now, you will very soon.
He’s gearing up to release his newest album HVN on August 19th, and is celebrating it with a release show on the same day at the renowned First Avenue’ Mainroom. Joining him will be Sean Anonymous, Ka Lia Universe, Bayo, and many more surprises.
I was able to chat with Nur-D about his upcoming album, his creative process, and so much more. The interview has been edited for clarity and length.
Andy Ellis: I've been listening to the new record, and, uh, damn! (Laughs)
Nur-D: Yay, that's what I like to hear! It's a good one, right? It’s a good ‘damn,’ not a bad ‘damn’.
A.E.: Yeah, it is! It's one of those where I really wish I would’ve been able to get it sooner, because it’s just so intense, but in a good way. And one thing I actually want to start off with is, could you talk a little bit about title itself of not the full word, but using those letters. How’d that come about?
Nur-D: Yeah, so HVN, it stands for “here versus not” was the idea in my head. And the reason I went with that was, because a lot of stuff over the last couple years has really made me think about what keeps me here. You know, what are the things that make me continue to live life but also just like the questions, and the wonderings what happens after we leave this place, and then just how those are all intertwined.
Like what's the difference between being here versus being not here? You know what I mean? And what does ‘here’ mean? Are you here for your community? Are you here for the people you love? Or are you here for your friends and your family? Or are you not? And why are those things? What is making us have those decisions? So I feel like, yeah, that's kind of why I chose to title it the way I did.
A.E.: I remember when I saw the announcement and the cover. I was looking at the cover art and my first thought was okay, this project looks like it's going to pretty much combine everything you've done up to now. That’s including your happy dance stuff and then also when you released the albums 38th and Chicago. This is a very intense album in many ways mentally, emotionally, and sonically. I do feel that this is a full artistic statement by you. Could you talk about the story you wanted to tell?
Nur-D: I think that this album in HVN kind of is sort of like an epilogue to 38th and Chicago, because I started writing it around the same time. Around a very similar time, some of these songs were written around that time. So being able to really sit with it and sit with with the emotions that come with, you know, thinking that you might die and what is important to you because of that.
I didn't want it to sound just like another record that I've made up until this point. I really wanted to, like you said, intensity. That is kind of what I wanted to really portray. It really doesn't let up until the very end, and I do so kind of like, because that's how life is. You know what I mean? Sometimes life just doesn't let up until the very end, whether it's super cool and fun. There are some really fun dancing type of tracks in there. There are some funny bits, you know, I do a little bit of jokes here and there, but there is also really heavy stuff in there. And so I wanted to kind of reflect how life is from sort of this sort of beginning to end concept.
A.E.: One of the songs that really hit me hard was “Mr. Officer.” Holy shit! I think with that song it’s both, I’ve never heard that angle before, but also it’s that grim letter to an officer saying like, ‘I know there's a very good chance of this happening, but can we please do it at a later time so I can still live a little bit right now.’ Could you kind of talked about that song and taking that angle?
Nur-D: “Mr. Officer” was a very kind of like a dark comedy sort of concept when I wrote it down. I really was feeling this intensity. And the reason, like one of the things that I talk about just in general in my activism work is just the reality that black people and people of color have to be more professional than the police.
We have to be more calm and collected, because if we act emotionally, nobody really dies. But when the police officers get scared, or they act out of their feelings or anger, their ego, whatever, people tend to die, and those people tend to be people of color. So even in the song, you hear that sort of like polite business tone of being like, ‘I would very much like to not get murdered or hey, I have two daughters at home. Do you mind if we wait to do this until after they graduate? You know what I mean? The sort of grim reminder of how composed we have to be when we encounter police officers? I wanted to write a song that was different than just like all the other kinds of like ‘these police officers are bad’ songs, which are all valid and a lot of them very good. But I wanted to do something a little bit different, that was just kind of like the Minnesota Nice version of that.
A.E.: Yeah, well it works. And with a song like that, when you're writing it are you writing it as if you are going to send it to an officer? Who do you want to hear it?
Nur-D: I feel like that song was specifically created in my head. It was sort of like an open letter to all police officers everywhere. Trying to kind of be like, ‘Hey, could you please recognize my humanity? That’d be really great just in general!’ But also I wrote it so that there could be a groundswell of that kind of conversation.
Because again, I think that at least in my experience, a lot of police officers, especially the police officers who really could use some changing, tend to automatically tune out anything that sounds too aggressive to them. They just immediately tune it out. You know what I mean? They don't want to hear it because they'll just assume that they’re in the right. So hearing a song that's a little that comes at it a little bit more sneakily will create more opportunities for people to sing it, for them to hear it, and them to really wrestle with the fact of what they’re doing.
A.E.: When I first discovered your music it was right around 2020. I think it was just after George Floyd. I heard your stuff where it was all this references to nerd culture and things like that. I was like, ‘This is really cool.’
And then I hear these two albums (38th and Chicago) I'm just like, ‘Oh shit.’ But it was the last track on 38th, “Goodbye,” you were addressing this turning point in your journey as an artist saying, ‘Hey, look, I am going to start actually addressing this more often than you’re used to. I know that this might turn you off, but I'm sorry. I can't not do it.’ When you’re at that point, like ‘Hey, I have this voice. I’ve got to say something.’ Is that a hard decision to make or is it just ‘I've got to do this, but I'm sorry.’ Was that a tough conversation you had with yourself or was it a relatively easy conversation?
Nur-D: It was a tough one. I mean, when you come up doing the kind of music that I do, you know, a lot of people tend to, like, no one asked me to write 38th and Chicago. No one was like, ‘Hey Nur-D can you give us your thought process on this.’ It was very much a thing that came about from just living life, being out on the streets, being tear-gassed, being shot at, like all of that stuff.
And I was like if my music is a reflection of me and reflection of my own life I can't not talk about this. So I did talk, you know, I had conversations with my DJ, and my partner, and my friends, and I was like this is going to be a really big transition for some people, and I don't know how it's going to go over. And It was tough.
I agonized over it for a little bit, because I was walking into a whole new space and putting myself up for some real big criticism and a lot of dangerous, you know, just dangers. Like just losing my career or just making the wrong people angry.
My music video for “Black Kid White Town” was on the front page of the Proud Boys website. I put a target on my back and I didn't need to. But to say that it was the right decision is clear to me. I lost fans, but not as nearly as much as I gained. And then just like in general, that be able to have the freedom to make the music I want to make is priceless.
A.E.:You were actually my introduction to live, local Hip-Hop. I saw your Utepils Brewing show where it was really cold. Amazing, by the way. And as you’ve had, especially locally, this rise in popularity that I really can only think of maybe Atmosphere got as well, how do you navigate that as a person and as an artist?
Nur-D: It's been such a lovely ride. Starting when I started in 2018 and then having to deal with 2020, and in subsequent years of things being very different than a lot of people who came before me. It's been a little tough to navigate. But what is never a disappointment is, how cool my fans are often. Like I love it when people recognize me. It's the coolest thing to feel like people know who you are and they like are excited about seeing you and they know your music.
And that's just wild, because I still think of myself as just like some random kid, you know what I mean, from Rosemount, Minnesota. In my head I'm not superstar Nur-D. In my head I'm like weird geek kid Matt. So I am still kind of getting used to people thinking that I have some sort of like energy about me that’s different.
It’s really lovely to hear all the kind comments, and everyone being so sweet to me when they meet me, and like people going out of their way to try and make sure that I'm comfortable is always really, really strange me, but very appreciated. And I'm loving it.
What I want to do is never take my position for granted, which is why I am very much like, ‘Let's give back.’ How do we pour back into the community? Because honestly, if it wasn't for the people listening to my music, and buying my CDs and my shirts, and my merch, and being so supportive, I wouldn't be where I'm at now. So it's kind of like a debt that I hope to repay with my actions.
A.E.: I want to go back to the this album a little more, because there is that very serious stuff. But it is also just a fun record. It’s Hip-Hop, it’s pop, it's everything is so, when you’re working on this record, it also feels like it's a very, very thought out album. When you were mapping this whole thing out, how thought out was it before you went into record it?
Nur-D: It's a living, breathing thing. I even talked about it in one of my songs, “HVN Intermission 3,” where that even as I’m writing this song it’s not done yet. You know what I mean? When I write my albums, when I write like big pig pieces like 38th and Chicago, it is a process, but it is nothing short of a living, breathing thing.
I'll know when it's finished, when it's finished. And I always feel a little bit weird, because people are like, ‘Oh, how's it coming on?’ Like honestly, it hasn't told me yet. I don't know until I hear it.
And there's certain things that I want to do, and I’d like to try, and I'd like to weave throughout, and that's very purposeful. But there is always a sort of element that I'm also surprised at where it goes. You know? Which I love! I enjoy that. So, it's kind of a mix of both.
Yeah, I plan on stuff and I like to try to keep things similar, and especially if I have a tone, or a theme that I'm rocking with. But honestly, a lot of times, I am just waiting for the right words, and the right things to say just like it's a person that I'm having a conversation with.
A.E.: I actually do want to mention the ‘HVN Intermission 3.’ And I'll be honest when I first heard I was like, ‘Oh, so this is the end of the album and it's like, oh, no it's not.’ And with song what I liked was there was this almost acknowledgment of ‘Hey, I'm not perfect or I have things I’ve been struggling with, too.’ Could you talk about that that part?
Nur-D: Yeah, so ‘HVN Intermission 3’ was a really powerful thing for me. That was one of the songs that just sort of came up. I had been writing HVN (the album) for a while. I was feeling like we just, it wasn't done, it wasn't close to finished, you know, like I was feeling like, man, I need to speak from the heart about something.
And then the words just kind of came out like I just wanted to have a space where I could just pull back the curtain and just have a real conversation, because I think those were some of the best parts of 38th and Chicago and even Songs About Stuff (2019). Some of the best parts of it was when I was being just really, really open and honest, because that is so rare in our today's society.
Everything is very manicured. Everything is very placed by a production company, or a person, or a brand agent, or something in order to make an artist feel like they are this caricature. And while I do that to some degree, I never want to do it at the expense of my honesty, my Integrity, my friends, my fans, and being like, hey, I know that a lot of people say, and also in reality, people say, a lot of things about me. Both positive and negative and both of which do a lot of damage, you know what I mean?
Like, people say negative things about me like you know, ‘Hey, you're not black enough to be a Hip-Hop artist and blah blah blah blah blah, and that's not very nice. But also people sometimes put my actions of activism and community engagement on this pedestal as if I could never make a mistake.
Because it's rare to see someone do some of the stuff that I do, not never been done, but just rare, so it's like people tend to forget that I'm human. So to remind everybody like, hey, ‘No I'm not going to accept all the negative stuff that you say about me. But also, I want to remind people that, like, I am not perfect. I am not this being that has never done anything wrong, and won't mess up, and doesn't change their mind on things.
I am capable of making a mistake. I want you to be ready for that ahead of time, but just know that even though I'm questioning things, even though I'm changing, even though I'm constantly evolving into a new person, my goal in my heart is to be there, and be good. While sometimes the music is the best thing that I could possibly ever do, sometimes it can be a crutch to keep us from being honest with each other, especially artists. We tend to hide behind all the lights, and the drums, and the sounds in order to get people to not look at us too closely. So I wanted to take a moment to not do that.
A.E.: Are there any other songs on here that you're just really happy with how they turned out?
Nur-D: First of all, it was so great to have a project with everybody from FairPlay (Entertainment) on it. FairPlay Entertainment has been such a cool group, and to be able to have this whole record where everyone gets a chance to shine on it was really, really cool. Everybody really, really loved that. All those songs turned out really great.
Obviously, I love “Black Sheep,” because I just released a music video with that song on it. That's a very fun song for me. I thoroughly enjoy it. “HVN Intermission 3” is one of I think the best pieces of art I've ever made.
But the two that really stand out to me as like, the things I’m really, really happy with one is “Heaven in this Bed.” I think it's my best ballad that I've written in a very long time. I thoroughly love how it goes. You know what I mean? I love that song. I think it's going to be something that people are going to be singing for a while now. Then “Weapons” featuring Mickey Breeze. I just think that song is so fun. The chorus really hit me. I love how we're just kind of having a time. It's one of my favorite songs on the album.
A.E.: One thing I've always been curious about is how you can seamlessly go from rapping to singing. How do you know when you're working on a song, whether rapping or singing is going to help you express that idea the best?
Nur-D: The song a lot of times will tell me as I’m writing it. You know what I mean? I’ll feel the vibe. I'll get the emotion from it. And I'll be like, oh yeah, this is going to be something where I'm going to be singing on it. Or this is going to be something where I'm rapping on it.
It usually kind of tells me but that being said, I think it's just a lot of it depends on what's more fun. Real talk. It depends on which more fun. If I feel like I can get a lot in with the rapping, that's great. If I feel like I can really hit to the emotion with some lyrics from a song, that's what I'll do. So it's a lot of fun either way. But yeah, it really depends on what the song brings.
A.E.: You are headlining the Mainroom at First Avenue which it's one of those where I do think that is a rite of passage for any local Indie artists. How does that feel? And what can everyone expect from the show?
Nur-D: It feels incredible. I, being able to do this, especially with the pandemic being what it is and people still not coming out as hard as they normally once would. To be able to put on a show for all these people, a safe show, at First Avenue no less, is such an incredible feeling.
I am humbled by how many people are coming. It is just a beautiful, beautiful, beautiful thing. I'm thoroughly invested. The show itself is going to be unlike anything we've ever done before. The band and I are working really, really hard to make sure that this is in fact, the show. When people talk about shows this year, in 2022, they're going to mention this show and they're going to say like, ‘Yo, Nur-D and the band just did something wild!’ And then the album is crazy. And this is going to kick-start Nur-D club across the world.
A.E.: Are you guys going to be able to play the full album at the show?
Nur-D: So we're playing a lot of the album at the show. It's kind of a mix of just cool stuff that we have together. A couple of things that people might know already. You know what I mean? Just to keep them ready to go, because no one's going to know a lot of these songs before we come out. You know what I mean? We are playing a lot of the record, but there's 20 songs on HVN. So even if you could come to the show, you're going to get a whole bunch of music when you get the album that you wouldn't have heard us do.
A.E.: Is there any is there anything else that you want to add before I let you go?
Nur-D: I think the only thing I'd like to add is please support local music. I mean, this is the kind of stuff that gets us to the next level. I hope that with HVN and when people are talking about it, it will be able to help me move to the next spot. And it's all because of you guys, so thank you.
A.E.: So someone's at your show and they come up to you and say, ‘hey, look, I’m really new to the local music scene. Who else should I check out? Who are the three artists you would have them check out?
Nur-D: Okay. Well, that's super easy because a lot of them on the HVN record. One is Nakara Forje. Nakara Forje is fantastic. She's with me on “Angels ‘Round Me.” She is a phenomenal MC. One of the top in the local scene and you really should check her out.
Obviously, anybody from FairPlay. Tuvok the Word, Lt. Sunnie, Mpls Drew, Mickey Breeze, DJ Hayes, you know, everybody, Brandon Pulphus. They're nuts. They're crazy good and super talented.
Then honestly a sleeper that's out there that's just put out a really dope record I was very happy part of who isn't on HVN, but just is really dope is Crow Father. If you like the Atmospheres, the Brother Alis, the height of that height timeframe of Hip-Hop in Minnesota, this is a dude with a good conscience, a good heart, but also the lyricism and the skill to paint those similar pictures. So Crow Father is someone you should check out.
